I see it's just another typical news letter day around here. Oh well, things look awsome, but itl suck if it get delayed again. That's all I have, back to reality.

When I started this thread, I didn't realize it would provoke an anonymous circle jerk by internet tough guys and Mensa candidates.

I'm sorry I asked.

Meanwhile...

If I had access to nukes, I'd use them. Everywhere.




The Jedi Master

No, like always you don't have a clue. You might understand software development, but obviously you don't understand what people mean from what they write. That or you are deliberately misunderstanding in order to be contrary because you get off on it. There are bizarre people like that out there, I don't understand how their brains can be so screwed up, it's like enjoying bloodsports.

I'm referring to the stupidity and nonsense that we are supposed to believe that ED has been hard at work on EDGE since before A-10C was released as beta and yet it is still in pre-alpha. A phase that by definition they were in from the very instant the first line of code was written.

That's not possible. It's a bit like saying Einstein wore diapers his entire life because he couldn't be potty trained. Sure, he can come up with the theory of relativity! Oh, understand what those urges are and make it to a toilet in time? Nope, that's hard!

They can make an accurate simulation of an A-10C, something no one else can, but they can't handle DX10 rendering in less than 5 years? Something that literally hundreds of other developers do easily on a daily basis, some of which are far smaller than ED by a significant margin (ie single programmer)?
Nope, don't buy it.




The Jedi Master

I wonder if ED has ever seen OUTERRA. 2 or 3 guys working on it.

Exactly. We know it's hard to make a good sim, so few have managed it. We know ED does an (arguably) good job at it.

Yet the side of their sim that is more in common with every other game out there than any other aspect, the graphics rendering, THAT is a big obstacle?

I accept the A2G radar stuff is hard. We've had lower level modeling in past sims, to get it right with decent performance is tough, understood. I believe that as a pacing item for the Hornet--no A2G radar with good performance, no sense releasing such a plane. Absolutely.

DX10 taking years upon years? No. DX10 came out in 2007, this isn't new tech.

Unless as I said it's a small part of what they're doing in DCS2 that either blew up exponentially large or they unfortunately tied the DX updating with the rest of the stuff that's not done, so we're forced to wait forever for something that could've been out long ago had they structured it differently.



The Jedi Master

Well, you see, as I keep saying, if ED would stop wasting, yes I said WASTING, development resources on WW2 "stuff" (to put it politely), the NTR would be out by now, at least in beta. PERIOD.

NO, it wouldn't have been. PERIOD.

You don't know, and it is showing - that is a fact, not a swipe.



'Graphics Rendering' is a very generic term, and it only deals with the version of DirectX peripherally.
ED has already changed DX in the existing rendering engine, and they decided to not upgrade past 9.0whatever since for them it was considered a waste of time - that effort would go into EDGE instead



If you see why A2G radar stuff is 'hard', why don't see that 'Rendering Engine' is hard? I mean A2G radar is like A2A radar, it just looks at the ground, right? Yes, you are operating on that level of assumption.



The rendering engine has a lot more to do with handling terrain than just displaying stuff to you (of course, it also displays the terrain).

The very reason NTTR is NOT in beta/A-10 etc is because the current terrain engine CANNOT HANDLE IT. It's not a matter of a little tweak here and there, it is flat out not worth a second of a developer's time to 'fix it' compared to developing a new engine.

A lot of what EDGE is sits very deep under the hook. If ED was able to swap EDGE out tomorrow you might not even see a difference without a new map.

As for how long EDGE has been in development? Yeah, you don't have to believe it's being worked on since A-10C, or even before it. That's your prerogative, but it still makes you wrong.
The version of EDGE DCS will be getting in not EDGE 1.0 (AFAIK). It has been used successfuly in other commercial products, and it is now being integrated into DCS. The work on EDGE has been going on for a long time. The work on integrating it into DCS not as long.
And that is why ED knows of and is not interested in Outerra.

Sure, okay. LOL.

OK, you read it here folks! GG can't read! He's replying to what he thinks I'm saying and not what I actually said! Never said Nevada should've been released for 1.0. I said their roadmap should've been restructured to get 2.0 done sooner. Comprende?

I don't accept that a rendering engine is hard for one simple fact:

EVERYONE ELSE CAN DO IT, INCLUDING ONE MAN PROGRAMMING TEAMS, IN LESS TIME. Happens all the time, all over, every day. Therefore, it's obvious they've not been working it that long because if they had they'd be done.

I also don't accept the "oh, you don't know, but it is!" BS explanation.
See, I know I'm right and you're wrong. How? "You don't know, but it is!" You can say anything you want, I'm not going to accept it, because you're wrong and I'm right. I know things you don't know, and that's that. It's really that simple. 40% of the nation's judges are extraterrestrials! I know, you don't, that's that.



Here's my SIMPLE plan for getting EDGE done in less time:

HIRE MORE PEOPLE TO WORK ON IT, FIRE SOME OF THE PEOPLE WHO ARE NOT BECAUSE THEY CAN'T. Easy isn't it? If resources don't permit just increasing total headcount, than shift resources from one department to the other. It's not rocket science, although apparently you want us to believe that a new rendering engine is.





Oh wait, never mind, you just said THE VERY THING I WAS SAYING. Brilliant! "Let me conclude my rebuttal by conceding you are correct." WTF? Did you just feel like contradicting me for the way in which I presented it when in fact you didn't actually disagree at all? Seriously you should actually read what you're responding to AND what you're writing in reply, because this looks ridiculous.




The Jedi Master

Please,
Give...it...a....rest...

It's a discussion forum Skate…you don't have to participate if you don't want to.

Where's their competing flight sim?



Apparently the only think you accept is telling a successful business how to run their successful business.
How many people do you need to hire to cook a meal? What happens if you hire more?



The ridiculous part is above. Where your competing oh-so-easy-to-make rendering engine?
Oh, right, 'other teams' do it.

You've read it here, folks. Jedi claims to have the very clue that he lacks - also, apparently he's a software development manager now as well. Simple. Easy.

It's not a discussion, it's beating a dead horse. No matter how much arm-chair-flight-sim-designing we do it doesn't change the simple fact that we are not privy to what ED is doing or how they are doing it. EDGE isn't here and all our bickering back and forth about why or how evil ED or fanboi's are is not going to change that.

EDGE is done when it is done.

Why don't we create a subforum for DCS rants (for and against) and stop this?

Need a DCS Equiv of PWEC, call it EDR, make it members only visible, so tye public non members see it, and move every ranting thread there, which will keep this section clean.

When a non member sees this BS, they join under the assumption that its the norm, and you get another angry pilot rage posting about ED,
pretty soon thats all you'll have.

Other games is whaT he is referring to. Not just another flight sim. Other small developers have done it in alot less time with less staff.

People are angry because dcs continues to promise release dates of the updated engine and terrain. Then back peddles once that date arrives.

this has been going on for a few years now.

Especially when they continue to put resource to other tasks instead of putting all their eggs in one basket to get edge integrated.

Their buisness model is flawed.