OFF P3 is an awesome sim but I'm having some very annoying problems being the first one related to the AI wingmen specially when they fly the N11 where they simply "sucks big time" at it. When my wingmen get to lower altitudes they simply keep making the same very odd manouver by climbing sudently and then getting down sudently as well (certainly due to entering in stall) and then climbing sudently and getting down sudently back again until they inevitably end up crashing into the ground and this instead of making more linear manouvers and directy pursuiting enemy aircraft and this of course completly kills the gameplay when flying in these situations (since wingmen become very inefective against the enemy and die very soon and basically leaving me alone against most if not all the enemy aircraft!!!). BTW, I'm playing as a wingman (not as a leader).
I also flew with Airco DH2 a few times and this problem doesn't seem to affect (or at least that much) the AI wingmen flying those same aircraft.

Nevertheless this problem is extremelly annoying, and I even considered stop playing OFF P3 or at least I'm seriously considering stop playing with the N11.


The other problem is related to the claim system. For instance in one mission where I shot down 2 Fokker EIII and where in both situations I was "surrounded by several witnesses" or to be more precise by most of my wingmen. I filled the claim report by placing the as a witness my flight leader and indicated that I shot down the 2 Fokkers EIII and the end result:
- CLAIM WAS REJECTED TO LACK OF CONFIRMATION!!!
This is very annoying, even because this wasn't an isolated case - It happened to me several time before!


So my question are:

Is there any thing that I can do to prevent those 2 annoying situations from happening?

Is someone else experiencing the same as I?

Re the AI, I believe CPU power has a big influence on how they behave. I have a 4ghz CPU and I've seen none of the problems with AI that you describe while running it, but I did see them at 3ghz. Might be just a coincidence.

Re claims, my guess is that a base-score between 1 to 100 is generated by the use of certain keywords in the claim, and then a 100-die roll is performed by the program to calculate the remaining. If the total score (base + roll) is less than 100 the claim is rejected.

Some suggestions.

First of all, be a leader. Be all you can be.

BECOME the Flight Leader. Take charge!

That way you can tell your wingmen what to do. I find the wingmen are vastly improved in 1.2 and they fight well and stay in formation (usually; they don't always follow me when I climb but they are below me).

I tell them to attack (pound the A key) and they engage aggressively. I tell them to rejoin (R key) and they break off their engagements and fall in on me.

Quite good, I think.

Why would anyone want to be a follower rather than a leader? But, then, I'm a retired real life Army colonel so I guess I just naturally lead. Some naturally follow. Well. what would the military be without lots of privates?

Select the leader option and I think you'll see a huge difference in the AI.

There are only about four commands you can give them. It isn't like you actually have to go through an officer course.

The claims system is indeed bogus.

I, too, have had claims rejected when there were lots of witnesses.

And I've had claims accepted when there was no one there to see my kill (I learned a long time ago in massive multiplayer sims -- the late great Dawn if Aces, actually -- to stay out of the furball and engage the enemy planes on the edges. I'm often drifting away from the main fight and often high above those crop dusters fighting in the dirt).

What is annoying is there is no logic to the acceptance or rejection.

In real life, I believe fewer than one claim in four was accepted.

That's okay and the sim should simulate (duh) reality.

But why reject the ones in which there are plenty of witnesses? I've even spelled their names incorrectly (with that goofy font OFF uses for mission rosters, I often have to guess whether it's an o or an a) and they have been accepted.

If I forgot to write out the name of the wingman beforehand, I just write in RFC Airman and some of those have been accepted.

It appears to be totally random.

Sorry to disappoint Poor le Marriott (does your family own hotels?) and all the others who waste time writing colorful after action reports (AARs). I've never used anything but the stock replies provided by the form and I'm certain my results are no better than all those wannabe Hemingways out there. Best case: Seven missions, six claims and five kills. And all I used was the stock wording.

Here's the AAR submitted by Roy Brown claiming he had shot down MvR (borrowed shamelessly from another forum):

http://www.theaerodrome.com/aces/cita/brown3.php

Not exactly flowery or detailed, is it?

ttt

Did you ever played with wingmen flying Nieuport 11s?
I'm asking this because while flying with a Nieuport 11 squadron I see that problem but I didn't seem to have noticed this problem while flying in a squadron of Airco DH2 (but I could be wrong).

My idea was to start my career in OFF in the lowest rank and evolve until I get promoted to higher ranks which would allow me to take charge and lead flights.
I'm willing to bet that even you did start in lower ranks in the army and that certainly you haven't started your military career as a colonel, am I right?


I guess that you're right about the claim system. It seems "buggy" or worse even it doesn't work as it should and I'm starting to agree that witnesses don't seem to count or affect the kills that are accepted/rejected and that this only happens in a random basis.
Guess that this is the end of the line for me regarding this "claim system"!! Fortunally with version 1.2 of OFF-P3 there's an option to disable the claim system and that what you kill is what you get. It's a petty because the "claim system" was an awesome idea but unfortunally is simply not functional and doesn't work as it should (there's probably nothing more frustrating in OFF to kill an enemy aircraft witnessed by several wingmen only to see that same kill REJECTED ) and for me how the claim system is working right now is even more unrealistic than an "automatic credited kill" that happens in all other sims.

Ok, so far it seems that I can confirm that wingmen problem is related to the Nieuport 11 and so far I haven't experienced this problem with other aircraft (but granted, I only flew so far in the campaign the Nieuport 11, Nieuport 17 and Airco DH2).
For example I started a new campaign as pilot from the RNAS 1 squadron (NOT leading flights and in the lowest rank of Sub-Lieutenant) but this time I started in a timeline where this squadron was already equiped with the Nieuport 17 (started in November 1916 if I'm not mistaken) and I can absolutelly confirm that the Wingmen pilot fights extremelly well and don't exibit that odd behaviour as I experienced when they fly in Nieuport 11s.

Can somone confirm this AI wingmen odd behaviour (ONLY IN NIEUPORT 11)?

I have the impression that this seems definitly be a problem related with the Nieuport 11.

The claim system has randomness of course, but it DOES use the DETAIL you put into it.
Enemy description, location, witness etc. There is still a doubt even with a perfect claim as someone else may have claimed it, or maybe the guy carrying squadron despatches had a bomb on his head... whatever.

However if you do not want to use the claim form change it! Go to workshops, choose, easy claims or whatever that's what it is there for

AI we'll look into, but not noticed any oddities in testing previously.
Try knocking your terrain and scenery to 4 each and see.

Polovski,

Like I posted in the OFF official forum (at Sim-Outhouse) I reduced the sliders to 4 (and some even to 3) and had the exact same results (regarding the wingmen flying Nieuport 11). I also noticed this problem doesn't affect other aircraft like the Nieuport 17 or Airco DH2 so I have my doubts that this could be the problem (too high sliders settings affecting the AI wingmen).
It also seems there are many users with the exact same problem. It shouldn't be hard to replicate this bug. At least it isn't on my rig since it happens 100% of the times.

Yep we'll look into it, just many things going on.. new patch out..

Very low powered craft AI struggle with more so that's why I suggested sliders. I.e takes more AI skill/quality to fly the slow/low HP craft.